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Thread: Why do carbs make you gain fat?

  1. #26
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invain View Post
    Are these typos then?
    yea, they were. thx for catching that. I'll add more later, as I have company over
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  2. #27
    LittleJake JSully's Avatar
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    great argument in here fellas..

    IMO, carbs don't make you fat, fat doesn't make you fat.. it's the combination when in a caloric surplus. One of Lyle's books even touch on this briefly. If you are in a calorie excess and taking in more carbohydrates than needed, all dietary fat will be stored....

    The real culprit is a high carbohydrate and high fat diet made up of refined and processed foods since near birth that just destroys our insulin sensitivity. Our cells get desensitized to the insulin and therefore the nutrients end up getting stored rather than burned for fuel. Once you increase your insulin sensitivity it gets much easier to drop and nutrient partitioning is much more pronounced at that point.

    I haven't read a nutrition book in ages, so I would look like a jackass if I tried using big words.. haha..
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  3. #28
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JSully View Post
    great argument in here fellas..

    IMO, carbs don't make you fat, fat doesn't make you fat.. it's the combination when in a caloric surplus. One of Lyle's books even touch on this briefly. If you are in a calorie excess and taking in more carbohydrates than needed, all dietary fat will be stored....

    The real culprit is a high carbohydrate and high fat diet made up of refined and processed foods since near birth that just destroys our insulin sensitivity. Our cells get desensitized to the insulin and therefore the nutrients end up getting stored rather than burned for fuel. Once you increase your insulin sensitivity it gets much easier to drop and nutrient partitioning is much more pronounced at that point.

    I haven't read a nutrition book in ages, so I would look like a jackass if I tried using big words.. haha..
    rofl. It's all good man. You bring up some good points. Sort of like a full circle to this.


    Quote Originally Posted by Invain View Post
    Lipogenesis isn't defined in any of my Biochemistry books, but, according to Wiki: Lipogenesis is the process by which acetyl-CoA is converted to fats (aka fatty acid synthesis). Says nothing about creating fat cells. There's a big difference between a fat 'cell' and a fat 'molecule'. I'm curious where you're getting your information from.

    You mention gluconeogenesis, which is not energetically favorable. This is the reason why I said excess carbs can be stored as glycerol in adipose tissue, much like glycogen in muscle cells.

    I also have never said carbohydrates alone are the reason people gain fat. I do believe they play a bigger role than the other two macro nutrients however.
    Well, I've been drinking.. a lot.. so I'll try to keep this shortish. Anyways, yea, lipogenesis is simply the creation of fat, for a better word. Typically, a fat cell has mostly TG's. Making fat cells through hyperplasia usually happens with really, really fat people. For the most part, fat gain is due to hypertrophy of existing fat cells.

    This is my only issue with whats been said. Dietary fat has a bigger potential to be stored as fat. This is a fact and really can't be argued. At the end of the day, excess Calories is what matters, but in a surplus, fat always wins. I mean just think about it.. think about what carbohydrates have to go through in order to help be stored as fat. Then compare it to actual dietary fat. Heres an excerpt for you.

    "After consumption, dietary fat is broken down repackaged into something called a chylomicron, absorbed into the lymphatic system, and appears in the bloodstream about 3 hours after you eat. While a certain percentage of ingested dietary fat will be used for energy or go to the liver or skeletal muscle for either storage or burning, some proportion will always make it to the fat cells where it can potentially be stored. This is unavoidaable" --Lyle McDonald

    So, let me you ask you this.. how exactly does excess carbohydrate trump excess fat is storage capabilities? And explain the study I linked that demonstrated..

    "After 8 control days of isocaloric energy balance, subjects on the 9th day were given an additional 1000 kcal in order to create a hypercaloric energy balance. As a result, carbohydrate and protein balance were achieved (oxidation equaled intake) while fat storage was preferential over fat oxidation."

    Remember, a high carb diet also has a high carbohydrate oxidation..(not storage) While this DOES suppress fat oxidation, it does not contribute to a large fat gain. So, I'll simply say, there are advantages to lower carb diets if fat loss is your goal.. but I think we are talking about hypercaloric conditions where body masses increases.

    p.s

    This is really splitting hairs, because thermodynamics matters most. But I'll gladly split these hairs because everyone learns from it. I know I learn more and more when challenged and am forced to look up facts over matters.
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    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMcGuire View Post
    rofl. It's all good man. You bring up some good points. Sort of like a full circle to this.




    Well, I've been drinking.. a lot.. so I'll try to keep this shortish. Anyways, yea, lipogenesis is simply the creation of fat, for a better word. Typically, a fat cell has mostly TG's. Making fat cells through hyperplasia usually happens with really, really fat people. For the most part, fat gain is due to hypertrophy of existing fat cells.

    This is my only issue with whats been said. Dietary fat has a bigger potential to be stored as fat. This is a fact and really can't be argued. At the end of the day, excess Calories is what matters, but in a surplus, fat always wins. I mean just think about it.. think about what carbohydrates have to go through in order to help be stored as fat. Then compare it to actual dietary fat. Heres an excerpt for you.

    "After consumption, dietary fat is broken down repackaged into something called a chylomicron, absorbed into the lymphatic system, and appears in the bloodstream about 3 hours after you eat. While a certain percentage of ingested dietary fat will be used for energy or go to the liver or skeletal muscle for either storage or burning, some proportion will always make it to the fat cells where it can potentially be stored. This is unavoidaable" --Lyle McDonald

    So, let me you ask you this.. how exactly does excess carbohydrate trump excess fat is storage capabilities? And explain the study I linked that demonstrated..

    "After 8 control days of isocaloric energy balance, subjects on the 9th day were given an additional 1000 kcal in order to create a hypercaloric energy balance. As a result, carbohydrate and protein balance were achieved (oxidation equaled intake) while fat storage was preferential over fat oxidation."

    Remember, a high carb diet also has a high carbohydrate oxidation..(not storage) While this DOES suppress fat oxidation, it does not contribute to a large fat gain. So, I'll simply say, there are advantages to lower carb diets if fat loss is your goal.. but I think we are talking about hypercaloric conditions where body masses increases.

    p.s

    This is really splitting hairs, because thermodynamics matters most. But I'll gladly split these hairs because everyone learns from it. I know I learn more and more when challenged and am forced to look up facts over matters.
    A couple of interesting books for reading.

    http://www.amazon.com/Good-Calories-...ref=pd_sim_b_1

    http://www.amazon.com/Calories-Dont-.../dp/B00176DRMY

  5. #30
    Senior Member RichMcGuire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by af92 View Post
    Completely worthless books from what I've heard.
    First Bulk pics VS Starting pics, take a look!! http://www.wannabebigforums.com/show...=1#post1616109

    Progress pics of a cut using bodyweight only movements http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/sho...45#post2405745

    Generally, if you read a piece of advice on the internet, assume it's wrong until proven otherwise. This applies especially to "conventional wisdom". -Belial

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMcGuire View Post
    Completely worthless books from what I've heard.
    Just looked interesting, nothing more.

  7. #32
    Senior Member Invain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RichMcGuire View Post
    This is my only issue with whats been said. Dietary fat has a bigger potential to be stored as fat. This is a fact and really can't be argued. At the end of the day, excess Calories is what matters, but in a surplus, fat always wins. I mean just think about it.. think about what carbohydrates have to go through in order to help be stored as fat. Then compare it to actual dietary fat. Heres an excerpt for you.

    "After consumption, dietary fat is broken down repackaged into something called a chylomicron, absorbed into the lymphatic system, and appears in the bloodstream about 3 hours after you eat. While a certain percentage of ingested dietary fat will be used for energy or go to the liver or skeletal muscle for either storage or burning, some proportion will always make it to the fat cells where it can potentially be stored. This is unavoidaable" --Lyle McDonald

    So, let me you ask you this.. how exactly does excess carbohydrate trump excess fat is storage capabilities? And explain the study I linked that demonstrated..
    I don't see any linked studies, but I'd be interested in reading it if you could find it and post it.

    I guess I should have said I believe carbs make a bigger difference when consuming all 3 macro nutrients, not necessarily by themselves. Obviously dietary fat can be stored easier than carbohydrates can be converted. I think many people underestimate/forget about insulin however.
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  8. #33
    Continuing... Time+Patience's Avatar
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    Threads like these make me think us lifters are taking things off-the-deep-end!

    I'm way to simple minded to bother truly understanding all of this. I'm sort of on the side with Allen, you gotta find what fits your body best.

    Also gotta agree with Rich, if you eat an excess of calories then you will store fat regardless of where it came from or what it came from. Maybe one day I'll read this thread again and it will make more sense.
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